Resisting the pull of cynicism since 1969.

Friday, December 30, 2005

Alberta separatism in the Edmonton CPC

buckets over at Bouquets of Gray has been doing some terrific sleuthing in uncovering an avowed Alberta separatist who's been managing Conservative incumbent MP Peter Goldring's campaign for Edmonton-East. The campaign manager has been posting at the right-wing Free Dominion message board under the name of 'Psycho', and buckets recounts his escapades in great detail here, here, here, here, and here. This information unambiguously identifies Mr. Psycho as Gordon Stamp, who right up until today was a central figure in the Alberta Conservative Party.

I say "right up until today," of course, because only two hours and twenty-two minutes after Paul Wells got a hold of the story, Peter Goldring's campaign manager position became vacant. Yep, Wells got another one, this time with the help of the groundwork done by the incomparable buckets.

In case anyone needed any more ammunition against Stamp, though, there's plenty over at another web-based forum called Project Alberta. Unlike Free Dominion, which defines itself as a mere "Canadian conservative news forum for the discussion of conservative philosophy and activism," Project Alberta clearly aligns itself with separatists. Their stated purpose is as a forum that "seeks to advance Alberta's interests regardless of Canada - we seek to improve Alberta and Albertans PERIOD, whether that is in or out of confederation." Stamp began posting there in July of this year, and has been a frequent enough poster to ascend to the level of "Power Member."

In this conversation about the differences between the Alberta Alliance and the Separation Party of Alberta, Stamp has this to say:

The SPA goal (separation) is straightforward. But it is not sellable because many voters are thinking the possibility but do not want to jump right into the water. While Albertans are less cautious than most Canadians, we still prefer to stick our toes in the water to be sure the temperature is okay...

The AA philosophy resonates with more people because it recognizes the same abusive concerns of the federal Liberals. The AA has a list of demands that voters (and the media) recognize as truths. If those concerns are not rectified, then and only then will the separation question be presented to Albertans.

The AA follows the philosophy of "How to make friends and influence people" - the SPA strategy is to bulldoze everyone who stands in their way (as verified by the SPA supporters on this topic thread).

Considering that separation needs support (votes) from Albertans, I will follow the path that gets those votes..
In another posting about a dinner appearance by Ted Morton in Edmonton, Stamp contributed the following:
Morton's Edmonton dinner last night was very well attended - approximately 170 people at $30 each.

As expected, Ted knew his stuff. He spoke fairly well with a few slips of the tongue - almost as if he was nervous with such a large gathering.

The thing I liked was that he did NOT skirt any questions from the audience after his speech. In fact he came across better answering off the cuff than when he read his prepared speech.

As expected, he re-iterated that he was 100% opposed to Alberta separation. (That is his only flaw with me because I really respect his platform.)
To add insult to injury, Stamp's "signature" in that forum at the time was "Canada as a nation has no moral justification to exist..."

There's more where that came from, but I'll stop there.

How many other Alberta CPC candidates have avowed separatists in high positions, I have to wonder? One posting over at Free Dominion written by someone named Hailey suggests the following of two Edmonton-area incumbents:
I've heard that Rahim Jaffer has a significant number of western separatists working on his campaign and I quite believe that. That's Rahim.

I've heard the same thing about Rajotte - not sure I am convinced though.
And over at Project Alberta, this rumour of other separatists working for other Conservative candidates seems to have been confirmed by someone who posts as GoTedGo:
I too am working for a campaign that has a federalist leader. That campaign does not know I in fact support independence. For Gord to tell Peter Goldring of his separatist leanings puts Goldring in a very difficult position. He should not have done that, so that Goldring would have deniability.
The Bloc Québécois may be working to end Canada as we know it, but at least they're honest about their ambitions rather than trying to hide them behind a supposed federalist agenda.

[CTV Update: CTV is reporting the story now.]

[FreeDominion update: Dan McKenzie of the Dan Report finds that Free Dominion did some late-night maintenance last night.]

[MoreMedia update: The Globe and Mail, the Edmonton Journal, and the Edmonton Sun are reporting on the Gordon Stamp story now.]

[Goldring update: buckets has noted that Peter Goldring, who called the Free Dominion "extreme" when being interviewed by the Edmonton Sun, once spoke at their banquet.]

[Level-headed update: Stageleft tries to cut through the insults on both sides and figure out what's going on here. I don't agree with all of his conclusions, but it's a great post and it has some great comments as well.]


HaileyVan said...

I have regrets about making that particular post even though I feel it was clear that it was just something that I had heard. Not something that I could verify or substantiate.

On it was shared that some individuals on Rahim's campaign team were separatists but that is hardly verification (If you want to look see the strathcona II thread on that site).

I can't remember where I heard it about the other MP but I certainly am far less likely to believe that.
Others who have worked on the campaign have been very clear that it's not factual.

Since I'm quoted in your blog I just wanted to re-emphasize and underscore that those are rumours only.

Candace said...

You might want to take a step back and ask yourself what, exactly, it is you are trying to accomplish? If it's to stamp out separatism in Alberta, I would argue that hounding people out of their positions (volunteer or otherwise) might not be the route to go. Particularly when the same is not done in Quebec (you know how testy we westerners can get, after all).

From someone supporting a party of "inclusiveness" I just have to ask: how inclusive is your stance?

Food for thought.

ps: haileyvan: "I have regrets about making that particular post even though I feel it was clear that it was just something that I had heard. Not something that I could verify or substantiate."
Gee, getting someone fired makes you feel bad, particularly when based on an unsubstantiated post? That's gotta suck. /sarc It's called taking responsibility for your actions.

Trooper said...

Oh, gee. Hailey has regrets?

Hailey's only regret is that as a radical pro-life, anti-feminist, sanctimonious, self-absorbed, gossipmonger she has no life outside of her reams and reams of "self-righteous" preachings on message boards like Babble and Free Dominion; she has no friends or a husband who will put up with her rantings is much more to the point.

Hailey's malicious "I heard" should be the basis of providing credibility to a so-called 'researcher'?

Anonymous said...

I hereby nominate Gord Stamp to succeed our current "toast to independence" Governor-General.

Idealistic Pragmatist said...


I did tag your comment as a rumour, but thanks for the reminder. And for the civility.


I hate to disappoint you, but I don't have any lofty goals here. I started reading about this, got curious, did a little more digging, and called somebody on saying something imprudent on the internet during and directly prior to an election. The Conservatives are hardly alone in that, as recent weeks have shown.

If I ever say something imprudent on the internet during or directly prior to an election, I expect to be called on it, too. Deal?

Cathryne R. said...

Sad that malicious character assassination and dirty tricks are the best a supposedly 'progressive' discussion group can come up with to win an election. I sure hope that the psychotic tendencies towards anything remotely conservative on that site is not representative of most NDPers.

This guy was the victim of political spin, but did the honourable thing, I wouldn't call anything rabblers do 'honourable'.

He's not a party official by BTW, he's a volunteer.

Mike said...

"This guy was the victim of political spin, but did the honourable thing,"

So cathryne, did Klander "do the honourable thing" as well? Oh wait he's a Liberals so everything he does is bad, right?

By your definition should a certain MP Rob Anders step down for his racist comments and calling Nelson Mandella a terrorists? I mean, that would be honourable.

Rabble is certainly over the top, but that does little to detract from the truth of the issue. If you wish to apologize for him, feel free to apply the same standard to all CPC memebers and volunteers.

I await that with baited breate...but I'm not holding it.

Idealistic Pragmatist said...

cathryne and mike,

You guys are aware that a) I'm not a rabbler, b) I didn't link to rabble, c) the only person to bring rabble up in the discussion here was Hailey--right?

Just checking. :-)

cathyrne R. said...

Klander did the honourable thing also.
I don't know what racist comments Anders made, and Mandella was a terrorist and admittted it at his trial, which is why he was jailed. Obviously it is not politically correct to call him that these days. And don't go interpreting that as condoning apartheid, I don't.

none said...

I believe that Hailey should not be attacked by people like this. I hope this is not the standard that one should expect on here.

Cathryne, "progressives" (whatever that means) don't seem to be interested in the facts that you have posted, but thank you for posting them as it stops the perpetuation of lies.